Stop wasting ETH just to return deposits

I would highly suggest to stop asking for ETH deposits and then returning them later. Such a waste of funds.

I would recommend staking UBI instead and getting a small fee in UBI that will be distributed to users.

Please do create a bridge and use another network that will also allow staking like BSC.

ETH gas fees will just go higher and higher.

BSC is a centralized blockchain, so I don’t think it would be a good idea to build on it.

The L2’s are coming, they are still unstable, but within a few months, it will be easier to build on them to reduce gas fee.

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Also, funds are to secure the Kleros Court in case of a challenge.
There is no way to use UBI for that,.

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use other network,maybe matic?

Five wallets control Matic via a multisig on Ethereum.
The staking is also not very decentralized.

L2s are not far away. It would be a shame from my point of view to waste time on this kind of blockchain.(this is only my point of view)

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L2 solutions are in research, but since the DAO hasn’t hired any develoeprs, we are all doing our part ad honorem.
All help on researchign how to implement L2 for POH and UBI would be nice.

Arbitrum was also an idea brought up

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I thought some people were working on this (StarkNet?)?

If not, I’ll be happy to work on it because I’ll need it for The Moloch Simulation at some point (for free, of course)

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@nolan it would be great to have at least one L2 solution running! I’d say go for it!

Just to keep in mind that if any change needs to be done on the Proof of HUmanity code a new HIP has to be created and voted upon to be able to make the update.

A good strategy maybe would be for you to check the requirements and then open a new draft HIP to discuss any concerns or questions.

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I’m working on porting PoH to StarkNet along with another user of the community. Right now the port is extremely experimental and my thinking about it is changing rapidly, so I haven’t submitted an HIP or even posted about it much here. I’ve brought it up though with Clement, Justin and a few other members of the community.

I’m not even sure that StarkNet is the right L2 to target. It requires rewriting all the PoH contracts in StarkWare’s own language, Cairo, and the ecosystem/tooling is still nascent. We’re working on that right now but it’s too early to say whether we’ll hit a hard block.

I’ll share more once the plans/architecture are more complete. And of course, my experiments shouldn’t discourage anyone else from pursuing other potential paths to L2 scalability. This is a decentralized project, after all!

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Perfect, it was my understanding that some people were already working on this.

It’s not urgent because the L2s are still very new and, therefore, with few users, but I think it will be essential for the success of Proof Of Humanity.

I’m not even sure that StarkNet is the right L2 to target. It requires rewriting all the PoH contracts in StarkWare’s own language, Cairo, and the ecosystem/tooling is still nascent

Optimism PBC, a L2 network on Ethereum that uses Optimistic-Rollups tech, is Introducing EVM Equivalence (definetly worth reading). Arbitrum, which is another optimistic-rollups focused L2, is working toward the same direction.

In their words “write once, deploy anywhere” which if I understand correctly means it should be super-easy to port a smart contract (dapp) from L1 ethereum to their L2. EVM-Equivalance means not only that smart-contracts can be ported to L2 but also the entire developer eco-system including languages (solidity, vyper, etc.) + dev tools (hardhat, etc.) + node clients (geth, etc.)

I do not represent them but I genuinly think they are doing some great work and might be the right Layer-2 solution for PoH.

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Optimism is not secure, fraud proofs are currently disabled, and the system permits invalid state roots…

Arbitrum seems to be a viable solution, but I think the Validity Rollup features are critical.
For example, we could have dAMMs so that we don’t fragment the little liquidity we have.
I think the DeFi Pooling is vital too for the same reasons.

The transpiler from Solidity to Cairo is already well progressed, so StarkNet remains, for me, the best solution.

I think moving POH on L2 would be great. On the type of L2, it’s hard to say now but I would tend to favor some L2 supporting solidity which is well known (experienced dev and mature security ecosystem).

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I just wanted to share this custom code written by a Mysterium (DVPN) dev that allows multiple payments as a single transaction. Their MYST token is in ERC20. They send extremely small amounts as rewards like $4 and I got curious about how they did it. One of the teams directed me to this GitHub post. See link below, hoping this could help you guys.

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Interesting, the only issue I see is that deposits are ETH (not ERC20).

However, this brings me to the question:
@fnanni @clesaege would Kleros Courts accept WETH?
If so, how feasable is it, in terms of implementing it?

As an alternative to using ETH, implementing WETH could help lower the gas fees a bit.

I don’t think WETH is better than ETH in terms of gas.

For some actions we already use this contract https://etherscan.io/address/0x82458d1c812d7c930bb3229c9e159cbabd9aa8cb to batch transactions, which is somewhat similar to what that Custody.sol contract does.

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Returning deposits is already batched with starting to accrue UBI, so doesn’t take extra TX (assuming one wants his UBI).